Modules & CMSMS Version 2.0

Talk about new features for CMSMS and modules.
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musicscore
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Modules & CMSMS Version 2.0

Post by musicscore »

Dear developerers.

Developing version 2.x of CMSMS is a great step forward for this beautifull cms.
I wanna give you some small advises:

Do not put to much features in the standard version but add extra function through modules and tag.
Keep it simple otherwise all those features which many of us do not need in all there designs will get in the way.

Look at Linux. There is a very stable kernel which is really fast (good performance), even on smaller systems.
Every distribution adds it collection of add-ons like GNome, KDE and so on.

Even Microsoft now is developing a (windows 2008) core server. Not to many features but a stable bases for additional applications without the ballas you do naot need. You may not like Microsoft but it is still the most succesfull of his kind.

The second advise is: Have an upgrade plan !
This plan could be :
  • Release a stable Major release every 2 year.
  • Release a service pack ever 0,5 year
  • Release hotfixes every 2 weeks
A major release is a complete new version, a service pack is all the hotfixes and new functionality's but still using the active release and hotfixes a bugfixes and security patches.

This way, the module developers know exactly what they can expect.

Also Linux and Microsoft use such upgrade plan (a live-circle)

I hope a helped you and if you think this is not the way CMSMS should be developed, I still think it is the best CMS on the marked.

Musicscore
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calguy1000
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Re: Modules & CMSMS Version 2.0

Post by calguy1000 »

So you would prefer, that when a major security flaw is identified we sit on it for two weeks until the next 'hotfix' release.  this doesn't sound like that good of an idea to me.
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Duketown

Re: Modules & CMSMS Version 2.0

Post by Duketown »

musicscore,

Although I'm quite new at development in CMSMS I like the idea that there is some sort of calendar to event taking place in the development arena of CMSMS. I must say that it appeals to me to have a stable core and everyone is able to add modules/tags and thus the end solution for a customer is a mosaic of add-ons but appears as one application.
Will it not confuse? Will development be easier of the modules? What to do with modules created for a stable version and the module owner is not available anymore when the next major release is available. Doesn't that hinder end users/consultants to upgrade? I strongly believe that a module that has had no update, for say a year, is to be either assigned to a 'volunteer' or should be move in archive state (never to be touched again).

calguy1000: I agree with you that hotfix should be made available whenever appropriate. Bear in mind however that musicscore 'only' requests for a vision that would help developers.
calguy1000
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Re: Modules & CMSMS Version 2.0

Post by calguy1000 »

I agree.... that we need to do a housecleaning of modules (even some of mine).... if they haven't had any activity in a year, a nice friendly email should be sent to the owner.... if no response, then all of the files should be removed from the forge (at least the .XML ones). 

But I'm still not sold on the regular schedule of releases.  Sometimes there's nothing to release... sometimes there is... Sometimes we run behind schedule by weeks at a time.... it's just not that easy to do.  Hell, we're having enough problems trying to find time to donate to CMS 2.0.

If we had a dedicated 'assistant' to help with all of this, then maybe it would be a bit easier.... I'm having problems just keeping up with the 40-50 modules I've written or assumed responsibility for.
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musicscore
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Re: Modules & CMSMS Version 2.0

Post by musicscore »

If you think 2 weeks for releasing hotfixes is to long then you should have a plan inplace where you release every week a hotfix.
But then, if software needs a whole lot of hotfixes, the testing was not good enough. If there are no hotfixes in a week, then no hotfixes are released of cause. But that looks to perfect.

Also it is possible to have 2 sorts of hotfixes.
1. 'important hotfixes' like security-leak fixes
2. 'bug fixes'

Release 'important hotfixes' every day if possible and 'normal hotfixes' once every 1 week.

If you release Service Pack and/or Major releases a fix time-interval you give developer of modules and/or tags the possibility to test there software against the new cmsms version and, if necessary, modify there software.
This is what is called the release-candidate version testing. By releasing a release-candidate the developers of modules can test there software against the new version and if necessary modify there software. At the end you can tell which module is working with what release of CMSMS.

An upgrade plan improves the stability of software products.
Last edited by musicscore on Sun Jan 06, 2008 4:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
calguy1000
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Re: Modules & CMSMS Version 2.0

Post by calguy1000 »

musicscore.... you sound an awful lot like a volunteer.  and we need as many volunteers as we can get.  Once you get acquanted with the product, the translations, the release mechanism, etc, you could probably help with testing, and generating releases.
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musicscore
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Re: Modules & CMSMS Version 2.0

Post by musicscore »

My profession is designing IT solutions (architect/consultant) for a company but then a have professionals like programma's and developers as resources.
So I'm not a developer myself, but I would like to help.
Thats why I'm building a website now where I want to describe de CMSMS Modules, tags and templates. You should find here information about the available modules, tags and templates. When I have a sample online, I will ask you developer guys what you think about it and who knows, you like it. If you don't like it, I will remove it. So it will be your decision. The first version will there in about 2 weeks (i told you I'm not a developer).

Musicscore
Duketown

Re: Modules & CMSMS Version 2.0

Post by Duketown »

musicscore,

Are the ideas that you put down here for a company that has paid employees (I don't know about Linux but Microsoft certainly is paying the developers) (I was typing this before you replied stating the type of work you are doing). I have not read any material of anyone being paid for their work at/with CMSMS. Bearing that in mind I totally agree with calguy1000 to release whenever appropriate. Would this be in some sequence/cycle then this would benefit the developers, since they know in advance when they are expected to upgrade their module(s).

calcuy1000: as you know I'm currently working Lahuindai to prepare Shop Made Simple. Next to this 2 modules for my own interrest that I want to share later on. I don't have much time leftover, but I volunteer to help you on modules that you wrote.

On removing modules: in a blog of september 18th 2007 it was said that the QA team would check upon this. Is there someone doing that work? I read http://blog.cmsmadesimple.org/2007/08/25/announcing-the-new-work-organization/ and then was looking for the postings of the teamleader ---> nothing. I guess he is doing all the work in the backend.
musicscore: volunteering for testing? Read http://forum.cmsmadesimple.org/index.php/topic,2297.0.html. Always in need of someone  :D.
calguy1000
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Re: Modules & CMSMS Version 2.0

Post by calguy1000 »

duketown wrote: Are the ideas that you put down here for a company that has paid employees (I don't know about Linux but Microsoft certainly is paying the developers) (I was typing this before you replied stating the type of work you are doing). I have not read any material of anyone being paid for their work at/with CMSMS. Bearing that in mind I totally agree with calguy1000 to release whenever appropriate. Would this be in some sequence/cycle then this would benefit the developers, since they know in advance when they are expected to upgrade their module(s).
Well... my current day job as a web developer mostly involves CMSMS.... but to develop websites with.  To do that, I have been writing modules, and fixing modules to provide the functionality our websites need.  My primary responsibility is not to fix and maintain CMS Made Simple.... therefore, any issues that come up with the core, and modules get fixed and released on an 'as needed' basis.  I try to refrain from modifying the core, unless there are no choices, or no realistic ones anyways.

Regarding fixed schedules or beta programs.... We've done things like this in the past.  We hoped to get module developers to update their modules, and to allow others to test for us to hopefully identify any bugs before the final release.  The conclusion by myself and others on the dev team is 'it doesn't work'.  Everybody here has their own schedules, their own lives, and their own priorities....  Very few users test, and most module developers (including myself) are too busy doing other things to worry about catching up on their modules until such time as a personal need arrives, or somebody is willing to pay a bit of money to get the developer to adjust his priorities.
calcuy1000: as you know I'm currently working Lahuindai to prepare Shop Made Simple. Next to this 2 modules for my own interrest that I want to share later on. I don't have much time leftover, but I volunteer to help you on modules that you wrote.
Yes duketown, and I was hoping to chat with you in irc about your modules, as Ted and I are doing a similar effort... I don't see a big problem in duplicating effort (it gives users more choices)... but it'd be nice to compare notes, etc.

And as far as volunteering for help on my modules.... I could keep you busy.... got any priorities in mind?
On removing modules: in a blog of september 18th 2007 it was said that the QA team would check upon this. Is there someone doing that work? I read http://blog.cmsmadesimple.org/2007/08/25/announcing-the-new-work-organization/ and then was looking for the postings of the teamleader ---> nothing. I guess he is doing all the work in the backend.
musicscore: volunteering for testing? Read http://forum.cmsmadesimple.org/index.php/topic,2297.0.html. Always in need of someone  :D.
As far as cleaning up the 'broken' modules, etc.  no, nobody has had time.  Our Q/A team lead left, and the documentation and website teams have been very busy with their personal priorities.... Hopefully this'll clear up in the next month or so. 

As I said... we need volunteers...  I think that there are two paths for volunteers, starting out on support/documentation/testing/translation..... or development.  if starting on the development branch we usually ask people to submit patches to the core or to various modules for review before getting commit access.
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musicscore
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Re: Modules & CMSMS Version 2.0

Post by musicscore »

I'm not getting payed for CMSMS. I'm a notive conserning CMSMS (build only 4 website with this CMS).
I'm an IT Professional for a Dutch Company (and they pay me not enough but then who is getting payed enough ).
I also not putting information here for a company but CMSMS is interesting to me personally (sportclub etc.).
I think it is my bad English that makes up the confussions.

But I sure want to do something back for the CMSMS community.

Musicscore
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